See evil, talk no evil

Yesterday, the Mustel Research Group Ltd. released a poll showing 36 percent of British Columbians support the provincial New Democrats - 15 percentage points less than the Liberals. And just 35 percent approve of party leader Carole James's performance. So how are the New Democrats responding to those latest poll numbers? Well, er...they're not. This, according to talking points distributed to legislators by caucus communications director Chris Gainor. The following is a complete copy of those talking points.

From: Gainor, Chris
Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2007 1:49 PM
Subject: Today's Mustel Poll PTN

May 10, 2007
Mustel Poll

Background

Liberals: 51 per cent.
NDP: 36 per cent
Green : 11 per cent

Gordon Campbell: Approve 47 per cent. Disapprove 39 per cent. Undecided: 14
Carole James: Approve 35 per cent. Disapprove 19 per cent.
Undecided: 47 per cent

Key Messages:

* In the past two weeks Gordon Campbell's government has been mired in scandal.
* We've been holding Gordon Campbell to account on special deals for friends and insiders, like Ken Dobell, alleged dirty political tricks orchestrated by his staff, and massive costs overruns on projects like the new convention centre.
* And we're keeping the pressure on Gordon Campbell.
* We say it's time to give working people a raise with an increase to the minimum wage. Gordon Campbell says no.
* We want to make life more affordable for average families. Gordon Campbell is raising rates, fees and fares.
* We are not afraid of open government. Gordon Campbell doesn't trust British Columbians to know what he knows.
* In the next election, the question will be: who will ensure average families benefit from a growing economy?
* British Columbians will choose a leader and a team that fight for the things that matter to average families.

22 Comments

Same old, same old NDP. Average families, working people, blah.blah.blah. With the ongoing slump in the polls you would think they might start to explore some new messaging. Are we ever going to see the “new” NDP ? This sounds like a press release we would have read from four years ago.

"Average families, working people, blah.blah.blah"

Thank you very much for saying this, Kevin. We now have your contempt and derision for working people and their families on the record, in so many words.

As the day wears on Kevin, you will be hearing disturbing news reports that StatsCan has found that BC's employment slipped by 16,000 jobs in April, a drop of nearly three-quarters of a percentage point in just one month. Does this mean that the long run up in growth and employment which has boosted Liberal political fortunes may have run its course? Could there be tougher economic and political sledding ahead for the Campbell Govt? If so, how would you like the Liberals to respond? With a crack down on unions, perhaps?

"This sounds like a press release we would have read from four years ago."

Can also apply to the NDP even 20 years ago.

The NDP under Carole Jame's leadership never comes up with anything new.

Back then it was "working British British Columbians", not "average families".

'Average families' seems to be the new label.

In regards to Budd's statement about unemployment falling a half point, he's off on a tangent again, since statistical analysis is about trends. There's ups and downs along the graph.

Compare 2007 with 1997 and you'll see a marked difference.

Budd's perported 'union crackdown' won't happen.


'Thank you very much for saying this, Kevin. We now have your contempt and derision for working people and their families on the record, in so many words."

Please, Budd, that is reaching ... even for you! While it is clear that Kevin has contempt and derision for the NDP, you make yourself look very silly trying to make such a ridiculous extension that he has contempt for families and working people. (AND, judging by those poll results, Mr. Larsen's views of the provincial NDP in BC certainly aren't his alone!)

By all means, defend the party, but c'mon, aren't you confident enough in your views to stay away from the childish rhetoric?

Budd, your antiquated rhetoric is so very tired. Look around, the Province is in excellent shape. Do the Liberals deserve all the credit for it? Of couse not, but they've been directing this bus appropriately and should (and are according to the polls) be recognized accordingly.

The NDP is played. It's stale, antiquated and has very little to offer. The talent in the opposition benches is weak to say the least. The NDP's stale policy under James, or Lali, or even Robertson will not be able to attract talent which is the root for success. They will continue to attract average candidates who fail to stimulate interest and define leadership. The party is full of less than successful individuals who cling to a "fabian" identity. Quite frankly, it's pathetic.

It's time for the NDP to collapse completely and for something else to take it's place. I wish someone with high enough profile (Please god not Gordon Wilson) and a truly liberal identity would start something new. Unfortunately in the polarized and amateur political ring that is British Columbia, those with the real talent have no interest in being pummelled by the bloodsport pendulum that is BC politics.

The "apparent" 51% support for Gordon Campbell is the only thing that is keeping NDP together.

Mike Farnworth wants to be in charge of taxing and spending and is posing as a moderate but his ambition is already public knowledge. Adrian Dix tries to revive the old NDP/communist empire that included jokers like Jenny Kwan and Corky Evans but is failing miserably.

Carole James however is lasting quite strongly, she continues to silent these dissents while still recovering. Rather than dreaming about becoming the premier, she is being realistic and is successfully blocking the media from finding a darling successor once she loses the election in 2009. But once nomination race starts, it'll be a lot more interesting as frustrated union activists backed by the old communist scheme against these new NDP moderates Carole James is finding to replace them.

The real story here is that the poll shows that Carole James polls BELOW the NDP. All of her syncophants have been spinning about how she is ahead of the party in the last few polls that showed the NDP on the decline. Now we have proof that the problem the NDP is facing is Carole James. Read the Mustel release. Respondents said that she is "weak", "not strong enough" and "indecisive". Carole James is a drag on the party and for the good of the NDP, should resign. I haven't put over 20 years of labour into the NDP to see her ruin it. Adrian Dix would do a superb job and would have us neck and neck with the Liberals, competing for Government.

Now internal party talking points are being leaked. Talk about disarray.

Not to mention these talking points are the dumbest thing I have ever heard.

"We're holding gordon campbell to account." Not that well, apparently!

FHK, you are really stetching things. Communist empire. complete with Jenny qwan, Corky Evans and adrian dix. You are so far off base you comments are laughable. The folks who decides who gets to be leader and keeps the position is not the folks on this blog but candidates to a convention all selected by their riding.

As long as the economy is running well, even Gordo looks good. Wonder how thing will sort out when the big cou case gets well underway?

In regards to Budd's statement about unemployment falling a half point, he's off on a tangent again, since statistical analysis is about trends. There's ups and downs along the graph.

You're absolutely right, Red Dog, it is about trends!

And I can personally guarantee you and everyone else here that every last single one of Gordon Campbell's economists and business advisors will be watching the employment data releases over the next few months very, very closely to see if this is just pure statistical chance, a glitch in StatsCan's monthly Labour Force Survey, ... or the first shift in the wind, the first change in the sky before the storm. Will BC's 2002-2007 residential spec building boom suffer the same fate as the one that ran from about 1988 to 1993?

Just to clarify, Red Dog, the really important thing about today's numbers is not the half point rise in the unemployment rate, but rather the three-quarter percentage point drop in employment in just one month, a loss of 16,000 jobs. At that rate, all of the gains over the last year would be gone in just three more months. Better stock up the beer fridge, Red Dog, ... it could be a long, hot summer.

Budd quit pretending to be an economist and quit pretending the sky is falling because you choose to "cherry pick" slight changes in macro economic indicators to suit your particular rant. If you were familiar with the budget you would know it was very conservative and had multiple contingencies in place for potential cool downs. Your numbers are no surprise to anyone as it was predicted when a much greater trend was showing south of the border. That outcome is not as serious as predicted and as such it's likely the slow down will not be sustained here. Get a grip and enjoy the perpetual growth.

Like it or not Budd, good times are here to stay.

"If you were familiar with the budget you would know it was very conservative and had multiple contingencies in place for potential cool downs."

LOL! The BC Gov'ts budget is not the issue, here. It's the economy, stupid!

So Budd; you have me on “record” now ??? What are you the Campbellsard of Public Eye Online all of a sudden ? For the record I was not assaulting “Working” families I was assaulting the NDP’s normally confidential speaking notes for being the same old tired & worn out NDP rhetoric.

Personally I don’t think anyone likes to be labeled as being “average” the so called demographic the NDP is preaching too. You meet someone on the street and say “Hi; I think you are pretty average to me and I am the NDP” somehow I don’t think that person is going to take being labeled as “average” to be a compliment.

Conversely the whole “working family” thing; some kind of BC Fed term to describe those people that are members of Unions; however we are all “working” families so for the rest of us this comes across sounding like some kind of exclusion just because we are not good ol’ fashioned NDP Union folk. Why use a Union term if you are supposedly a party not all about organized labor; at least according to Carole James ?

Combined being told you are “average” and a “working person” well; who votes for that? This is old, tired messaging that lacks any vision or even imagination and clearly it is not working. Whoever leaked these speaking notes likely thought the same thing and they would obviously be an NDP insider.

Same old, same old Budd, kind of like your NDP apologists posts that never change. And by the way; I didn’t hear squat about any public uprising over the Stat’s Can numbers, but I did hear about a few business having to close this weekend because they didn’t have enough staff to stay open.

"LOL! The BC Gov'ts budget is not the issue, here. It's the economy, stupid!"

Which is doing just fine, thank you.

The sooner we've gotten a new leader, the sooner we can defeat the Campell Liberals.


Like a lightning bolt from above. Budd Campbell is not some self opinionated crank from an East Side co-op. It is David Perry. Come clean Budd...er...David.

God, partisan politics is boring.

You bad, me good.
No, YOU bad, ME good.
You worse, me better.
Ba-a-ad ... ba-a-ad.

The NDP under Carole James has been a complete disappointment. The idiotic attempt to condemn Ken Dobell as an insider (he is, but who cares anyway?) and the equally stupid attempt stir up outrage about "dirty tricks" in the Premier's Office (who cares anyway?), plus being completely outmaneuvered on the pay increase/pension deal (Harry Lali was right, and 'Carole' was wrong), points to an Opposition without any ideas, vision, strategy or even basic tactical skills.

Does the NDP have a climate change strategy or coherent position on the environment? No. Does the NDP have any alternatives to the Gateway project? No. Does the NDP ever publicize the effect the Olympics are having on the Downtown Eastside residents? No. There is no alternative vision whatsoever. It is not a progressive organization, and depends on well-used tropes from the last century.

Perhaps the NDP is content to sit on the Opposition benches after the next provincial election. But James's low-key style is not suited for her role as leader of the Opposition.

The NDP was right to challenge Dobell however the key is to take a few shots and move on. Give the impression that you have so much to criticize that you cannot afford to waste too much time on one topic. Instead the NDP seem to think if they get a mention in Vaughn Palmer’s column they have a major hit on their hand and reply the same issue over and over and over and eventually come off sounding like a one trick pony with nothing else to offer.

I do agree that inability to have a position on anything or even worse; having a position against everything is not helpful. They are also being very short sighted; if the Olympics come across anything close to Expo 86 Carole James is already setting them up to look like a ship of fools in 2009-2010 right during an election when they can least afford too.

I don’t totally blame her caucas because it seems obvious that Carole James rarely listens to them. Whoever her advisor is; they are giving her bad advice. Telling her to come out swinging against the pay raise and not allowing a free vote could likely be the final nail in her coffin. After all; Big Unions are all about big pensions and big pay. Wonder why Carole James thinks they should make less money than Jim Sinclair does.

Does the NDP have a climate change strategy or coherent position on the environment? No. Does the NDP have any alternatives to the Gateway project? No. Does the NDP ever publicize the effect the Olympics are having on the Downtown Eastside residents? No. There is no alternative vision whatsoever. It is not a progressive organization, and depends on well-used tropes from the last century.

Perhaps the NDP is content to sit on the Opposition benches after the next provincial election. But James's low-key style is not suited for her role as leader of the Opposition.

What a load! If Knocked on doors is trying to fool any one he/she might start by claiming the did phoning in two elections. Knocking on doors hasn't been done for years, except for candidates, and I think that's pretty much true for all parties.

Carole James and the NDP did present a climate change plan, as Knocked well knows.
{see http://nid-16443.newsdetail.bcndp.ca/} And they have kept track of Olympic costs and impacts as Knocked also knows {see http://nid-16636.newsdetail.bcndp.ca/}. Knocked is clearly one of the professional James bashers, either with the BC Liberals, or with some hopelessly deluded NDP backbencher who believes he can be Premier if he can just get Carole James out of the way before the 2009 election.

And as far as Knocked's silly demands for alternatives to Gateway, what alternatives? Does he mean the GVRD's fake proposal to "road price" the very freeway system they have opposed building since the 1960s? Another joke that zero members of the general public will fall for, but which some political hacks and ecological bullshitters will continue to peddle as part of their inward looking, chattering class routine.

Knocked is clearly one of the professional James bashers, either with the BC Liberals, or with some hopelessly deluded NDP backbencher who believes he can be Premier if he can just get Carole James out of the way before the 2009 election.

Sorry, Budd, but you're totally wrong - I'm just a grunt who knocked on doors for an NDP MLA candidate in the 2005 election, and an NDP MP candidate in the 2006 election. Glad to see I pushed some buttons, though, and hit close to home, and that my observations resembled those of a professional.

Too bad, Budd, that you have to resort to name-calling. Too bad, that is, for you, because you have lost the argument.

Why is it Budd that you accuse everyone else with an opinion of being some kind of political sock puppet and yet you are the most blatant obvious example of someone spewing endless and ongoing pro Carole James propaganda like some kind of permanently broken record ?

I am still laughing from your “strong and decisive” leadership claim, easily the most bogus thing ever posted on the Public Eye Online. Add that to your Campbellsard record of political sock pupeting at it’s finest.

Problem is that Carole isn't suited for leader of the opposition since she finds it hard to oppose things. As such, she'll never be premier either. Time to move on and get another leader.

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