I bet the Conservatives wouldn't mind running Mason Loh in RMD. I think the fact that Loh defeated Chan in RMD over the Super Weekend probably made Chan quite upset.

I wonder what Yuan's response is to all this? As junior as Yuan may seem, she certainly came out of all this looking better than Loh and Chan.

Ethnic politics is beyond so many of us...and I hope Alice Wong is fully prepared should she decide to go for the nomination.

As Mason Loh is a card carrying Liberal, he does not quality to run.

Thank God for Horton! Finally someone with a perspective that makes sense. Having Wong run is no better than having Roodnick run. They both appear to be motivated by personal moral beliefs that are either of no consequence or incompatible with Canadian society.

Until the Alliance fringe is sigificantly wacked down, the "Tories" can only hope for yet another minority.

And if that happens.....you read it here first, the only answer for the Conservative Party (and their best chance for a majority)...

The Right Honourable Gordon Campbell, Prime Minister of Canada. If Mulroney's prime ministership can be born on the back page of Maclean's (in Dr. Foth's column), then a Campbell as PM candidacy can be hatched so here.
His French cannot possibly be worse than Presto Meandering's. Gordon is very well liked by other Premiers across the land and is very popular in other Provinces as well. At national conferences, he has been peacemaker, bridge builder, policy promoter, you name it--and his word counts. Perfect. And right in time for 2010.

Ah, per chance to dream.....

Yes, ethnic politics is beyond so many of us...Over the super weekend, first was Chan's big bus, then it was Loh with his dinner and signatures controversy...

No wonder you feel that Yuan came out of Super Weekend looking quite good...Hopefully, Yuan will help to write a new chapter in ethnic politics and demonstrate that women do politics differently...I hope Yuan regains the Kingsway Liberal seat.

"The Right Honourable Gordon Campbell, Prime Minister of Canada. "

Oh puhleez. The guy is a micromanger gone wild,
and is very stubborn, doesn't comprimise much and his arrogance is legendary.

Has business education, but doesn't adhere to the primary aspect of business. That is working with a team rather than ensuring the underlings are working for a tyrant.

No charisma. Ontario wouldn't take him.

"If Mulroney's prime ministership can be born on the back page of Maclean's (in Dr. Foth's column),

and look what happened to Brian Baloney.

Went on a tirade against patronage, but in the end ended up being worse than the Liberals on that.

Decided removal of the Manufacturer tax was a good thing (which it was), replaced with the GST
which taxed things which were never taxed originally. The GST was supposed to pay for the
debt, but was never rescinded despite Mulroney saying he would do so.

"then a Campbell as PM candidacy can be hatched so here.
His French cannot possibly be worse than Presto Meandering's. Gordon is very well liked by other Premiers across the land and is very popular in other Provinces as well."

He causes alot of glazed eyes here.

"At national conferences, he has been peacemaker, bridge builder, policy promoter, you name it--and his word counts. Perfect. And right in time for 2010."

Seeking a job with the guy, Alex? Want to be Martyn Brown's replacement? Kelly Reichart's?

Hell the way the BC Liberal Party is run under his leadership is abysmal. Very little motivation to get involved, practically everything is controlled by their headquarters, who answers to The Gordomatic.

Forget it. Would rather vote for someone else.

Even Peter Mackay would be a better choice than The Gordomatic.

But, remember Alex..

"Ya dance with the one that brung ya".

Dr. Alice Wong is a far more credible candidate than Wendy Yuan. You are looking at a Chinese version of Hedy Fry right here. It will be interesting to see how long she can last.

As for Charlie No-name...lol...Since Joe stepped over the forbidden territory, whatever Charlie says now can only be taken as a joke. Whoever takes his word seriously is making a joke out of himself.

As for Dr. Alice Wong, her far more superior credential against both of the candidates is without question. Without social conservatives like Dr. Wong, Conservative Party of Canada would have gone nowhere. Alice's candidate has never lost a nomination race, and given that she has picked a favourite yet, I am more than sure that there will new heavy weight candidates from the riding coming out by the end of the month.

The conservatives are sucking air in BC. The lumber deal hurts forestry workers in the province. The war policies of Harper (and Bush) are hated in BC. The net tax increases (GST down income tax up) were taken as an insult. Convention-donation-gate and third-party advertising made front page in BC. The no environment "plan" offends British Columbians. etc. etc. etc. The CPoC is in disarray in BC... rightly so.

"The conservatives are sucking air in BC."

The NDP is sucking air in B.C.
The Liberals are sucking air in B.C.
Everyone is sucking air in B.C.

"The lumber deal hurts forestry workers in the province. "

Lots of things are hurting forestry workers.
The deal is the best the forest industry could
get from the Americans.

"The war policies of Harper (and Bush) are hated in BC.

Seems to be support out there for the Cdn Forces
in Afghanistan.

Wouldn't worry about Bush though. He can't run
again for President.

"The net tax increases (GST down income tax up) were taken as an insult."

The GST has always been taken as an insult.

"Convention-donation-gate and third-party advertising made front page in BC. "

Bingo-gate made the front the page in B.C.,

Budd, there is no "Convention-what-ever-you-call-it-gate". If there was, it would still be news,
but it isn't.

Interesting you never mention the millions of
taxpayer dollars the federal Liberals took from the taxpayers during Adscam.

"The no environment "plan" offends British Columbians. etc. etc. etc. The CPoC is in disarray in BC... rightly so."

Conservatives are doing just fine, thank you.

The NDP? Same old, same old.

Has Jack-In-The-Box talked to the Taliban over a Timmie's and maple dip donuts yet?

Stats Canada Religious Breakdown

No religious affiliation 42965
Protestant 20355
Catholic 19880
Buddhist 7765
Christian nie 5895
Muslim 2775
Jewish 2230
Christian orthodox 1280
Sikh 1175
Hindu 1050
Eastern religions 275
Other religions 135

"No religious affiliation 42965
Protestant 20355
Catholic 19880
Buddhist 7765
Christian nie 5895
Muslim 2775
Jewish 2230
Christian orthodox 1280
Sikh 1175
Hindu 1050
Eastern religions 275
Other religions 135"

..and the value of those who think religion should be kept out of politics and kept at home and in a place of worship where it belongs?

... priceless.

Tom Tory,

Your comments regarding Mulroney's GST blunder are almost correct. If the appropriate (and promised) tax relief had accompanied the GST, you would have seen a significantly better result. We're agreed on that much.

More to the point, Gordo the Magnificent is a celebrated micromanager, true--but that would be what would make him a winnner as PM...indulge me for a moment...

When Mayor, Campbell's skills at helping everyone polish their respective apples was what made the NPA, and more importantly the City, great. Micromanager as Mayor works. As Premier, he's had some challenges with some Ministers privately complaining about not being able to spit shine their own ministries, but again, getting into their faces--for many, made them better ministers and kept them from harm's way. Not everyone can be a Taylor or Falcon. But as Prime Minister, due to the vast responsibilities he will inherit (they all do), he will be forced to channel that (sometimes) micro-managerial style and take better care of, and in, government than Harper and certainly Martin before him (let's just keep trying to forget Chretien). Gordon will not be able to get into the Ministers "stuff" since there are so many of them and their tentacles will be almost as long as his. Essentially, he'll have to ease back a little, giving himself time to breathe and think about matters before diving into a particular ministry (which I know he doesn't do as often as his detractors say he does). His fastidiousness and meticulous attention to detail will help him, not hurt him.

And, no, I am not looking for a job as I have about two too many of those for the moment.

Finally, if you are who I think you are (or related to that former "dancer") I have only one resolutely unrepentant comment to offer you....I'm sorry I left you at the bar, really, I am, but you promised me a devil in a blue dress, and what you delivered was a scarecrow in a red sash.

"Sorry Mr. President, but I don't dance". Maybe it's you that should remember THAT.

Take good care.

Since Alice Wong has already ran and lost twice (Kingsway 2000, RMD 2004) she requires a special dispensation of the National Council of the Party. Highly unlikely to receive that, given their recent decisions against good candidates.

1. Rules are rules. But rules are created by people.

2. Alice Wong ran twice, but she in fact only ran once for Conservative Party. FYI, Conservative Party of Canada was only born two years ago and Dr. Wong was not a CPC member in 2000.

"Since Alice Wong has already ran and lost twice (Kingsway 2000, RMD 2004) she requires a special dispensation of the National Council of the Party. Highly unlikely to receive that, given their recent decisions against good candidates."

Ain't going to happen, since Alice ran in 2000
with the Progressive Conservative Party, not the current Conservative Party. The two are completely different entities.

She doesn't need a special anything to run, if she has a current CPC membership.

She'll be allowed to run for the nomination.

Be there if it happens.

Tom Tory,

"Your comments regarding Mulroney's GST blunder are almost correct. If the appropriate (and promised) tax relief had accompanied the GST, you would have seen a significantly better result. We're agreed on that much."

Thank you. But you didn't mention the barrage of patronage that Brian Baloney got into despite his
legendary "you had a choice, sir!" statment in 1984. Talk about hypocritical. His patronage antics was abysmal.

More to the point, Gordo the Magnificent is a celebrated micromanager, true--but that would be what would make him a winnner as PM...indulge me for a moment...

When Mayor, Campbell's skills at helping everyone polish their respective apples was what made the NPA, and more importantly the City, great. Micromanager as Mayor works.

To a degree. A sound manger keeps a firm hand on the helm, but doesn't get into the details as the Gordomatic seems to do. Remember your first year Management. Let the good people do their jobs.

As for the NPA, there were internal problems back then A few pro-Campbell power hungry people wanted to run everything.

"As Premier, he's had some challenges with some Ministers privately complaining about not being able to spit shine their own ministries, but again, getting into their faces--for many, made them better ministers and kept them from harm's way. "

Well yes and no. Not going to learn much if too much control is put on the ministers. Have to learn through error too. If the error is severe enough, the Minister can be toast.

Have to let the person run the department if they are going to be successful. never do the work for them.

Otherwise why bother being the head of the deparmtent if the Comany owner keeps running it all the time. The better companies are run on a
team effort.

"Not everyone can be a Taylor or Falcon."

So why not have Gordon loosen up a little so that more promising people can be Taylor or Falcon, or is it only for the privileged few?

But as Prime Minister, due to the vast responsibilities he will inherit (they all do), he will be forced to channel that (sometimes) micro-managerial style and take better care of, and in, government than Harper and certainly Martin before him (let's just keep trying to forget Chretien)."

If he wanted to chase for being PM, I'd tell him to lay off more on that micromanger style of his.

"Gordon will not be able to get into the Ministers "stuff" since there are so many of them and their tentacles will be almost as long as his. Essentially, he'll have to ease back a little, giving himself time to breathe and think about matters before diving into a particular ministry (which I know he doesn't do as often as his detractors say he does). His fastidiousness and meticulous attention to detail will help him, not hurt him. "

There's a difference in being attentive to detail
and being excessively micromanaging. The two are not equated to each other. Gordo should take a page from Bill Bennett. He wasn't a micromanager
and let the ministers do their jobs. But if they screwed up, they were out. Ask Bud Smith.

I'd also ease up on that blind loyalty. Gordo
has has successes, but remember the Cabinet is essentially a team effort. Everyone does their thing.

Blind loyalty to the leader is not a good thing. It did BC Social Credit in, just as it did with the old Progressive Conservatives and to a lesser degree the federal Liberals.

"Finally, if you are who I think you are (or related to that former "dancer") I have only one resolutely unrepentant comment to offer you....I'm sorry I left you at the bar, really, I am, but you promised me a devil in a blue dress, and what you delivered was a scarecrow in a red sash."

Didn't promise you anything, sweetie because I wasn't there. I don't go to bars. A boy or girl meets more interesting people at the restaurant or political event than the bar.

"Sorry Mr. President, but I don't dance". Maybe it's you that should remember THAT.

Who is "Mr. President?" This ain't the U.S. fella.

"Ya dance with the one that brung ya."

Gordon Campbell as leader of the Conservatives?

No thanks. Seen him as leader. He's not a suitable candidate. Next applicant, please..

Don't worry. The rules apply for both legacy parties as well. The party wants to rid itself of perennial losers, and Alice Wong is one of them. (BTW she ran for the Alliance, not PC Party in 2000). Her candidacy will be actively discouraged, most notably by those living in Richmond who found her to be a disaster on the hustings. Her friends should have checked that with the powers that be prior to putting out the news release. Game over before it starts.

Don't worry. The rules apply for both legacy parties as well. The party wants to rid itself of perennial losers, and Alice Wong is one of them. (BTW she ran for the Alliance, not PC Party in 2000)

Same thing. Aliance doesn't count as it doesn't exist.

The CPC counts two successive losses, ie. 2004,
and 2005. Not accumulative loses (2000 and 2005).

Sorry to disappoint you bud, but those are the rules. Can't factor someone's losses in a party that no longer exists.

If Alice decides to run and runs against Zowie
Howie, then so what? They'll both have to be voted on at the nomination meeting. Only one will
win.

Let the membership decide who gets to be the candidate.

be there when it happens.

Jeez, youz guyz are tryin' to look like youz read the rulz. It's not working.

Jeez, who are all these anon posters pretending that they know what they're talking about. Put your $20 down for the fundraiser with Monte tonight if you're actually a conservative supporter or if not if you have the juice to say face to face what you post anon on the net, show up! I rarely agree with Alex T but at least he doesn't hide who he is.

The National Council did not approve rules with any intent on a single EDA like Richmond but for a broad national intent to clear out some old losers who have gatekeeping control of their EDA.

As has been posted, the rules state that:

"unless waived by the Director of Political Operations in consultation with the President of National Council, the person must not have been an unsuccessful candidate in both of the two prior federal elections;"

Alice Wong is a legit candidate according to the rules, her positives and negatives are an issue to be debated in the upcoming nomination and the decision will be made by the membership. In my 30 years in this political world, I've rarely seen a candidate lose an election who had a high level of broad based support in their community. It is the duty of each member of the EDA to act as a member of a hiring committee and decide who is most likely to beat that guy who is a MP.

Budd, there is no "Convention-what-ever-you-call-it-gate". If there was, it would still be news,
but it isn't.
..

Conservatives are doing just fine, thank you.

The NDP? Same old, same old.

Has Jack-In-The-Box talked to the Taliban over a Timmie's and maple dip donuts yet?

Posted by Tom Tory on October 11, 2006

First off Tom, I didn't say anything in this thread.

But if you must know I think your conclusion that the Tories are doing fine is quite wrong. Eugene Parks is, for once, quite correct in identifying the lumber treaty, foreign policy and environmental issues as signal weaknesses for the Tories. January 2006 was the Conservative high-water mark in BC for at least the next five to ten years if there's an early election, so you had best hope that there is no election until Harper's legislated date of October 2009.

One thing you will have going for you by then is the absence of President Bush. In fact, some of the heat on you will go down if the Democrats do well enough in this November's mid term election that Bush is seen as not just a lame duck but a sterilized lame duck. Off hand, I think that will require a gain of about 50 or more in the House of Representatives and 5 or more in the Senate for the Democrats.

As for your silly remarks about Jack Layton, I think you and some of the other Tory bloggers, especially the truly incredible gathering of right wing flotsam and jetsam that Hate McMillan hosts at SmallDeadAnimals, ought to learn to treat serious foreign events with the appropriate degree of solemnity. You don't make yourself look sophisticated by laughing, giggling and snickering about events that involve death and destruction. On the contrary, you go well out of your way to feed a pre-existing impression that Conservatives are by and large a pretty harsh and rough bunch.

"Jeez, youz guyz are tryin' to look like youz read the rulz. It's not working."

You obviously can't spell either.

"Jeez, who are all these anon posters pretending that they know what they're talking about. Put your $20 down for the fundraiser with Monte tonight if you're actually a conservative supporter or if not if you have the juice to say face to face what you post anon on the net, show up! I rarely agree with Alex T but at least he doesn't hide who he is."

is he supposed to be the current version of
Mr. T? Does he have a fear of flying. I pity da fool. Hate to see him with a heavy dose of jewellry on.

What is Alex T supposed to be anyway? he's just
an ordinary supporter like the rest of us.

If he says he has campaign management talent, well I would say "that's fine, but we need 30 signs to go up by this afternoon. Here's your tools. Meet Charlie and the boys over at his house. It's either that or clean the campaign office as a few MP's are coming here tomorrow."

The National Council did not approve rules with any intent on a single EDA like Richmond but for a broad national intent to clear out some old losers who have gatekeeping control of their EDA.

As has been posted, the rules state that:

"unless waived by the Director of Political Operations in consultation with the President of National Council, the person must not have been an unsuccessful candidate in both of the two prior federal elections;"

To those who figure that Alice will be disqualified. Note that it says in both the two
prior federal electios. Which means 2005 and 2004. Not 2000.

"Alice Wong is a legit candidate according to the rules, her positives and negatives are an issue to be debated in the upcoming nomination and the decision will be made by the membership. In my 30 years in this political world, I've rarely seen a candidate lose an election who had a high level of broad based support in their community. It is the duty of each member of the EDA to act as a member of a hiring committee and decide who is most likely to beat that guy who is a MP."

Exactly. So get goin'.

She is a legit candidate. Simple.

Let the membership decide. It may be either her or Zowie Howie.

How terribly entertaining...Budd spouting off about harsh Conservatives, George (who apparently has no balls to proffer his last name or real name) decides to attack Tom Tory for his anonimity, while doing the same, and I'm supposedly off to the jewelers!

Good grief, boys! So much entertainment in one feel swoop?

I am indeed a Conservative, but not an excuse monger like George. Alice Wong is yet another social conservative who offers no chance for the Tories in Richmond.

But here's a slo-pitch for the rest of you: get on to the website of the ever-sensitive Zowie Howie campaign, and see the first media piece prominently featured--a story from a Richmond paper saying exactly what I have been trumpeting from the beginning...Alice Wong is another soCon who cannot win in Richmond.

So much for Team Jampolsky distancing themselves from my otherwise supportive comments in a an earlier but related stream (they clearly were worried about my disenfranchising the extreme soCons from their efforts). That very theme is prominently featured, though, on their candidates website as that's precisely what the article says! Genius advisors. Howie is so well served.....hope they've got Ransford at least. Top notch Bob wouldn't put up with that horsepucky.

Will this be another case of an otherwise very good candidate being run into the ground by lickspittles, who are mere pretenders in the political sandbox? Time will tell. But some of his advisors defintely have a case of do as I say, not as I do.

You know Mr Tsakumis, it surprises me that an actual confidante of a major elected official would bother to get involved in chats like this. Usually the eminence gris type likes to keep a low profile and share their advice only with the inner circle.

I do agree with you, though, that another "social Conservative" nominee in Richmond is not to the Tory Party's advantage, or in any other riding, besides about four to six in the Okanagan or Fraser Valleys. In fact, to the list above (softwood treaty, foreign entanglements, environmental issues) I would add the continuing Conservative dependency on an intolerant religous right as among the party's largest albatrosses.

It's a problem that you and others will have to either fix, or face the consequences. Just yakking about it is totally insufficient. Remember, once a party is in power, the voters tend to scrutinize it more closely and more critically, and deficiencies that were previously ignored or even tolerated on balance may become insuperable bars to re-election.

Alex..

Welcome to the Asylum.

"You know Mr Tsakumis, it surprises me that an actual confidante of a major elected official would bother to get involved in chats like this. "

What causes you to think Alex is an actual confidanet of a major elected official? Does Alex work in a political office as a paid staffer?

He is as can be best found out a campaigner who
works campaigns.

I do agree with you, though, that another "social Conservative" nominee in Richmond is not to the Tory Party's advantage, or in any other riding, besides about four to six in the Okanagan or Fraser Valleys. In fact, to the list above (softwood treaty, foreign entanglements, environmental issues) I would add the continuing Conservative dependency on an intolerant religous right as among the party's largest albatrosses. "

Budd I think you're not doing your research. By the majority of the numbers, the nutty religious right does not have a dominance in the Conservative Party as they did in the Alliance.

But let the membership decide. If they elect the wrong person, they'll have to live with the outcome. Let's not get into this "don't allow Alice to run because she can't win/is a social conservative".

It's a problem that you and others will have to either fix, or face the consequences. Just yakking about it is totally insufficient. Remember, once a party is in power, the voters tend to scrutinize it more closely and more critically, and deficiencies that were previously ignored or even tolerated on balance may become insuperable bars to re-election.

That was also true with the BC NDP, if you remember. The NDP federally is scrutinised but
the federal NDP and its members don't like that
too much. But they seem to like scrutinizing the
other parties.

But remember Budd, you only speak for yourself, not the entire BC voting population.

Let the voters decide the candidate fates.