Counter-strike

I laughed out loud at Buckham's assertion that the de-elect Emerson campaign aren't the only ones who can put people on the streets!! Our sidewalks are crowded with the homeless and I expect that if Harper continues "down that road", we'll see a whole lot more of them.

Today's Toronto Star shows that Emerson appears to dislike his new Tory friends. Here is a quote:

"Behind closed doors, the Conservatives are worse partisans than the Liberals ever were," Emerson said, according to notes Epworth wrote after his conversation with the minister.

Maybe we will get a chance to see what fierce partisans they are out in the open!

Thru Liberals will give the[in a disengenuine efford to "help"the homeless] a tax brake.The homeless are the by product and creation of liberal policies.

Senseless people believe what they see. Just another Liberal smear to fool Canadians. Emerson represents the people of Vancouver - Kingsway better than anyone can or could. Cheers David. Keep up the good Work

I don't remember seeing anyone publicize the methods used to get the de-elect Emerson people out, maybe those notes and emails are sent from NDP offices so it would be too obvious. Does it not occur to anyone else that they aren't that a big a group considering the amount of free national media coverage they are getting? Does it also no occur to anyone else that noone has made nearly this big a deal of any other floor crossing by any other person or party?

I'm not sure what anon means by "down that road" but it seems to be another classic blame Harper for everything kind of sentiment. Yes, you're right, the guy whose been the PM for a few months is the cause of homelessness in Vancouver, what and oversimplified ridiculous thing to imply.

Dave--

You may have a point.

Then again, have you taken a drive down King Ed lately?

.

Hah! Looks like the Tory Bloggers are trying to back Emerson up on this one!

Just hilarious - they are really out of touch with the average vancouverite on this one - I am suprised they didn't post David = Courage! LOL!

We'll see you there!

I agree with Sheila, the Conservatives are underestimating the impact Emerson's defection to the Cons the very day after being elected as a Liberal has had on the average Vancouverite.

www.emersoncampaign.ca is where you can go to find out who the people are behind the De-elect Emerson campaign. Concerned citizens sign up for emails about events concerning the defection of Emerson. Political parties (except the Cons) do not send out blanket emails to their supporters regarding this campaign or planned events. It is not a political campaign, it is a grass roots organization made up of people of different political stripes and walks of life who care about democracy and the value of a vote.

All we want is for David Emerson to resign and run in a by-election.

Holy cats, when other CPC like Garth Turner MP turn against the David Emerson ... and people like myself who are nowhere near Vancouver Kingsway really want Emerson to stand for re-election ... it takes a pretty fancy spin doctor to cram all that indignation inside the NDP's constituency office doors.

But what does it take to start believing that crap? Isn't that a zero-sum?

So Sheila, all you want it for Emerson to do what has not been required of the dozens of other floor crossers from all levels of government in the last 5 years? That makes perfect sense.

If weeks worth of national media coverage only brings 500 people out to the biggest organized event this group has had then I think you are overestimating their impact.

I'm not saying everyone loves the Emerson situation but Harpers approval rating is higher is BC right now than it's ever been so what does that say?

Just wondering. How many people who voted for Emerson did vote for Emerson because he is David Emerson, a results person, rather than Emerson simply because he was originally Liberal?

There were more people who voted for David Emerson as a person than there were those who voted for David Emerson simply because he's Liberal.

Invisible tories! I've just returned from the Emerson demo downtown & his supporters were invisible. No really and literally invisible! Stealth counter-demonstrations, what a concept! They sure can get the troops out, can't they?

One lone Conservative came to the demonstration at the Hyatt this morning. She hung around alone for about 15 minutes, then left.

There were about 100 people over the 3 hour demonstration and the support from the public was very good.

People bought De-Elect Emerson campaign buttons, ordered lawn signs, took the information leaflets and promised to email and write Mr. Harper and Mr. Emerson demanding Emerson resign and a byelection be held in Vancouver-Kingsway, signed the postcards to be sent to Mr Harper and Mr Emerson in Ottawa. The giant postcards have thousands of signatures.

I spoke to several tourists, and was astonished to learn that people from New Zealand have heard about the debacle at V-K. They took a few buttons and encouraged us to keep working for the cause.

All in all, it was a good turnout for a sunny Friday in the most beautiful city in the world. The media were there, so perhaps we shall see some of it on the news tonight.

If the de-elect Emerson crew really was working for a cause they would hold more water for me. That being the cause of stopping all forms of floor crossing everywhere.

The fact is that this happens all the time all over the world and if you think it's wrong then take it on as an issue. Going after only Emerson with so much passion only lends credibility to the theory that the de-elect Emerson crowd is mostly Conservative haters with too much time on their hands.

Where were they when Belinda defected? How about Brison or Dosanjh? And are they really against all floor crossings? Most experts agree that banning it altogether gives way too much power to party leaders. Independants almost never win so you're essentially forcing someone to quit politics altogether by taking away their right to cross the floor.

I don't like floor crossing much either but this isn't the simple issue the de-elect Emerson crowd wants everyone to think it is and the media is doing no favours to democracy by giving this single-minded and misguided group so much coverage.

"He wants to quit but his wife won't let him."

Really, this item has received far too much attention. Sure, party switchers should be required to face a byelection, no matter which party they leave, or which party they join. That's a simple matter of respect for the voters.

But when you look at the rage here and elsewhere from jilted Liberals, you really have to wonder who they're trying to kid. This whole episode is really classic Eastern Red-Blue politics, a duopoly structure in which cosmetic rivalry not genuine competition is the game.

There's so much effot being spent on this because neither the Red nor Blue team "kool aid drinkers" can afford to admit the obvious, that the distinctions between their parties are in fact transitory and trivial. A businessman's politician switches from the Blue Business Party to the Red Business Party, ... and we are all supposed to care. Not.

I do believe there is a large contingent of out of riding NDP protesters slagging Emerson.
Like the guys the cops caught smearing brown stuff all over the outside of Emerson's office.
These "disgruntled voters" happened to be from that NDP hub of New Westminster.

The point is how fast he switched, and how nothing transpired to create a switch except power.

Othe crossers did so for reasons such as policy clash, and closer to an election.

The point here is that it was the next day, and it opens a huge door for anyone to run under a winning banner in a riding, and switch the next day.

I am a conservative (small c) and I can tell you, there are a lot of us not happy with this situation, and some of my acquaintances have gone to a rally or two. They are absolutely not NDP, and neither am I.

If I were the NDP, however, I would seriously consider trying to get my candidates on a Liberal ticket somehow, and all switch the next day.

They may actually form the opposition that way.

In fact, the Conservative Alliance could form a majority by using the same tactic, but with more than just Emerson.

The flood gates are open if Emerson doesn't run in a byelection, and this has done nothing but brought total disrepute to our electoral system.

The protest is more of the federal Liberals than the NDP.

The group would have more credibility if they start to slime Scott Brisson who is about to launch his leadership campaign.

I'd like to thank Will Hammersall for the clearest explanation so far, of what's continuing to bother many of us -- no matter where we live -- about the David Emerson brand of democracy.

I agree that the Emerson switch was uncomfortabley close to the election, (though it wasn't the next day) and Budd Campbell makes a good point here as well in that the line between red and blue (and even orange) in Ottawa is a thinner line than partisans care to admit. Emerson is a great example, he's a former Social Credit, a small c conservative party so it shouldn't shock anyone that he would join the Conservative Party.

However to give any credit to the theory that Emerson is power hungry or did this for the raise in pay that a Minister gets is downright silly. Emerson took a massive paycut to enter politics, and he has admitted he has no long term political goals.

Also, if you believe for a second that Belinda left the Conservative Party for policy reasons you're more than a bit naive. She clashed with Harper on policy issues certainly but she's still very much a small c conservative on most topics and likely has more opinion clashes with many of her current Liberal colleagues than she ever had on the other side. She wanted to take the short cut to more power and ironically is on the other side now again.

Emerson was in the Social Credit government bureaucracy as a deputy minister but never ran as a candidate for that party.

He did take a large pay cut and didn't even need to run, but did so to accomplish good things for British Columbia.

Belinda is a silly girl born with a silver spoon in her mouth (never even finished university),
and has an ego.

Scot Brison has entered the Liberal leadership and it will be interesting to see if these De-Elect types will go after him when he arrives in town for speaking to the Grits.

Just an aside to all this talk about Emerson crossing the floor before there was a floor to cross; how do you Reformed Tories feel about your Leader using tax dollars to campaign across the country? He's been on the campaign trail ever since he was elected to a Minority Government and in my neck of the woods that once an election is over, the campaign time to get down to work on behalf of ALL Canadians. I resent my tax dollars going to pay for his trips across the country, bashing everyone in sight. It's unethical.

Call me naive but there it is.

"Just an aside to all this talk about Emerson crossing the floor before there was a floor to cross; how do you Reformed Tories feel about your Leader using tax dollars to campaign across the country?"

Who says he's campaigning? He's selling the budget which is what every leader does, be it Jean Chretien, Glen Clark, Ujjal Dosanjh, Paul Martin...

He's been on the campaign trail ever since he was elected to a Minority Government and in my neck of the woods that once an election is over, the campaign time to get down to work on behalf of ALL Canadians. I resent my tax dollars going to pay for his trips across the country, bashing everyone in sight. It's unethical.

The Liberals certain had that one down to a science. What was nauseating about them amongst other things was that they kept insisting to voters that they were "Canada's Party".

The federal Liberals have to realise the election is over. Their MP's are in opposition.

The train left the station.

Oh please: "selling the budget"??

Call YOU naive. Or a dyed in the wool follower no matter what the issue is.

It is the Reformed Tories who must get it through their heads that the election is over. I pay significant taxes for health care, roads, education and so on, not to fly Harper from one province to another campaigning.

I'll say it again: it's unethical to use tax dollars to campaign when there is no election. Actually, it's outright thievery.

So much for ethics and accountability! Harper is as big a thief as the rest of them.

There's little doubt that Liberal Red partisans are furious with Emerson, because his move let's the cat out of the bag on them, ... it demonstrates that the Liberal "vote strategically for us to stop the Conservatives" suffers from a fundamental flaw, that is, the very small distinctions between those two parties.

NDP partisans are interested in forcing Emerson to quit so that a byelection can be held in which their candidate would likely win.

I have said many times that the solution is for Premier Campbell to appoint Vancouver Quadra MP Stephen Owen to some distinguished provincial position, so that byelections can be held in both Quadra and Kingsway. Emerson can run, and probably win, in Quadra, while the NDP will pick up Kingsway. That way the Tories and NDP each gain one and the Liberals lose two. That's a scenario that the Liberals in the De-Elect Emerson effort aren't thinking about, ... otherwise, they'd stop pressuring the guy.

Belinda Stronach a "silly girl"? What cave are you living in?

anon, your lack of logic and genuine dialogue isn't helping this discussion.

To be angry about a Prime Minister flying around the country is a fairly ridiculous statement.

Stephen Harper is the Prime Minister, he's going to spend a lot of time touring the country so get used to it. And yes he's going to spend some time talking about why he thinks he should continue to be the Prime Minister when he tours, just like every Prime Minister has done in the history of Canada.

Did you know that MP's from all parties tour the country on your tax dollar as well? They're not spending all their time at non-partisan events. Paul Martin used to spend you tax dollars to fly out to Liberal fundraisers and then go home, I appreciate the new Prime Minster not wasting my taxes on that kind of trip.

You're fine with a PM using your tax dollars to campaign when there is no election; I'm not. I don't agree with you. Can you handle that or do you need to be "Right"?

anon, I can handle you disagreeing but you need to make a stronger case if you want me to agree with you. I'm sure you think you're "right" as well.

Every PM in history has been expected to travel the country regularily and they end spending a bunch of their time talking about what they're doing in Ottawa. If you call this campaigning, that's fine, but just admit that every PM has done this whether in an election year or not, and frankly I would think it's an even worse thing during an election so I don't get your point there.

This is part of the advantage built into our system for the incumbent, no matter what party. They have the right to keep the public informed using tax dollars, this is one of the privelages of being elected. All MP's from all parties use their free mailing privelages to keep constituents informed of their activities, this would also be campaigning by your definition.

Budd - Emerson couldn't even win in Quadra now, he's damaged goods and that's a "good thing". Maybe he could run for parks board in Kamloops and win.