I think this riding is winneable for the Liberals. Contrary to what some may think, people maybe somewhat socially conservative, but it is not a bible belt riding like Abbotsford. In fact there has been a lot of growth in this area and most have come from the city who are more likely to be Liberals. The only advantage Russ Hiebert may have is social conservatives are more likely to show up at the polls than middle of the road voters, while those who are terrified of social conservatives are equally as likely to show up as social conservatives. Most peole in this riding would fall into neither camp, although I would say the social conservatives have a slight edge over those who are terrified of social conservatives. Another thing to remember is the NDP and Green party votes. The NDP and the Greens have no chance at winning here, but if they do well here (over 15% for the NDP and 10% for the Green Party) the Conservatives will likely hold this, while if their vote collapses (NDP under 10% and Green party under 5%) the Liberals should win it.

hello blood sport fans

I think Jim Green should stick around and fight the results that (I believe) were illegally skewed by Sam Sullivan supporters who put James Green up to steal votes from Jim. Is anybody else wondering what James Green meant when he was quoted last week as saying that he had 300 campaign workers and by E day he would have 1000 workers? Was he being cocky? Did he mean that the Vision Vancouver team would be working for him because he knew many voters would mistakenly vote for James Green?

How does a guy with several backruptcies and zero public profile manage to get more than 300 votes? Does anybody else question why, when people who were confused about the Jim & James issue at the polling stations asked for clarification, they were handed the candidate info booklet printed in English? How is that supposed to help people not fluent in English?

At the risk of being labelled the King of Sour Grapes...I think this issue stinks bad and that stink will stick to Sam until this smelly situation is dealt with in a court of law.

Many years ago it was common practice in Quebec in federal elections to fine independents with names virtually identical to those of party candidates being entered in order to siphon off a percentage point or two here and there. But that was in the days when party affiliations were not on the ballot.

It's obvious what the intentions behind the James Green caper were, and it's equally obvious they had some material impact. Is it enough to void the election? A judge would have to determine that I think, and this archaic bit about "inducements" isn't enough to get you there. A judge would have to decide to buy into the statistical arguments, that this was enough to alter the election and was just as improper as having ineligible voters casting ballots. I don't think that's going to happen, but if there's any evidence linking NPA backers to Green Number Two, it should be argued in court if possible.

In any case, Sullivan's already paid a big price for this bit of horseplay. The honeymoon lasted about a day and a half, ... he's gone from hero in a wheelchair to politician supported by plumbers in less than a week.

Sleeps - how was the Jolly A on Saturday night.
As for the two Greens - weren't there also two Gordon Campbells in Point Grey in 2001 - didn't seem to be a problem - any two year old knows the difference between a Jim Green and a James Green - the party name Vision was on the ballot - I think Vision was so sure that they were going to win that they make no attempt in their literature or ads to emphasize which was the proper candidate - this is not the first time nor will it be the last time that people with similiar names have ran and rarely has it being a problem.

As for Geoff Meggs - he is busy cleaning out his desk at city hall - claims he hasn't any plans yet.

Hey Sleeps - how about those 9-1 and 10-0 predictions you made of COPE and Vision dominating Council? Pretty sure James Green can't be blamed for the NPA dominating council and putting your predictions to shame.

Had the situation been reversed Vision Vancouver would be putting Jim Green up for Saint hood.
Time Jimmmy got his snout out of the public trough and got gameful employment.
A bully and a sore loser nobody needs not even Ottawa

My predictions were fuelled by an excess of overconfidence..no doubt about that.
As for the JA..I was so bagged that by 10pm I was sound asleep..a very disturbed sleep only saved from complete misery by the tender mercies of an angel.

Other people, like Phillip Owen, have also made ill considered remarks about Jim "sucking on the public tit". What do you call it when a right winger does the same...how about grand theft?

Re: James Green..we haven't heard the last of this and if I'm listened to..it should go before a judge with the desired outcome being a two man run off for mayor. There is lots of precedent around the world for that plus I didn't here the fat lady sing yet.

Sleeps, there is nothing illegal involved, (as long as all campaign donations are declared) and while a pipe dream may be for a redo, I don't think anyone wants a half million dollar mayoral election, especially with the feds right around the corner.

But you know what, James Green got the most press of any independent in years. I mean, Tyee wrote an article on him, he was all over the sun and province, as well as TV. Like it or not, a lot of people knew who he was. He was the protest candidate of the election. If you didn't like the NPA and didn't trust Vision, he was where to plant your mayoral vote. It happens all the time. In the last election 13,000 people voted for the 3rd, 4th, and 5th candidates.

Time Jimmmy got his snout out of the public trough and got gameful employment.
A bully and a sore loser nobody needs not even Ottawa

Posted by BobR at November 23, 2005 06:28 PM

What, if anything, is this supposed to mean?

Sam Sullivan won fair and square and James Green won all his 4,000 votes. Perhaps a hundred or so folks made a mistake at the bb.

Plus Jim Green fans need to realize that 71,000 Citizens voted against him. I suppose now Sleeps that you think all those 71,000 made mistakes at the ballot box. Too funny!

ah,,, sleeps,, sent to the cleaners,, i,m sure,, and glad you understand what it,s all about,,, as for budd campbell,,, next time you visit montreal,,, pick up a phone book,, then you,ll see alll the same names,,, as french in quebec is nothing but slang......

this buds for you,,, the light>>>>>

There are many out there trying to portray James Green's campaign as "hard working" and that he "earned" his votes. If those same people were asked to give an honest opinion on what the chances would be for an unknown with a dodgy business background to get more than a few hundred votes you would hear another story..provided those same people could actually be capable of giving an impartial answer.
Common sense and the evidence tells us two things:

1. An unknown candidate with dodgy credentials is a 300 vote wonder.
2. The NPA were involved in James Green's campaign

The third would be Jamie Lee trying to make us believe that only a 100 or so people made mistakes on their ballots and that a shady businessman that 99+% of the electorate had never heard of could garner 4000 votes on his own steam.

Dan

Yes, James Green got some publicity and it invariably exposed his dodgy backgroung. How is this supposed to endear voters to him?
Your're not stopping to consider that a lot of voters have poor eyesight and/or struggle with the language or were in too much of a hurry to notice the mistake they made.

I don't really expect an NPA or Jamie Lee supporter to see reason on this.

Oh Sleeps c'mon. Unlike you, we are using reason and not emotion. Your boy Jimmy lost. Time to move on. If there was anything untoward, the American can go to the police. I'm sure it will make their day hearing the particulars of how he lost the election. Nice try with the spin Sleeps. I'm not gloating either since I didn't win but at least I'm mature about my defeat and not blaming the Voters for it like Jimmy Boy is doing!

jamie lee was part of the sleaze.Good news is that those who did not see Sam "I am in a wheel chair" for what he really is, a liar do so now and it is not good.And no one had to spread any sleaze, Sammy did to himself all by himself.

Sleeps! What happen brother? What happen to all your frothy prognostications (sorry, but I have to kick your ass again, gently, just this once--again!!!!!

Listen, here are the facts ladies and germs:

1) The secular left are infamous at the litigious and the linguine (read: weak!). The NPA won council (barely) because they had strong candidates individually and collectively and The Sun endorsement helped immensely. Parks was always up for grabs, so was school, you guys did sweet f**k all for three years except ply the public with left wing nut bar dogma and allow that idiot Louis to talk about Che Guevara, on par with Hitler, Ceacescu, Milosevic, Hussein. The NPA ran it's second most weak campaign and if was better prepared, earlier, would have swept council as well. Besides, who would you rather have, Ladner or Roberts? Anton or Woodsworth? Capri or Bass? The choice was easy. The NPAers that won are middle of the road, centrist, but fiscal conservatives with certainly not bleeding, but leaky hearts. All good, my man. I'm glad Cadman won byt he way, he's a solid guy and a decent sort, who cares about the City.

2) Slammin' Sammy carried the day. The comparison in terms of credibility was not even fair. One guy who admitted his mistakes and appeared every bit the man of the people, and then Jabba the bloody Hut, who told us Woodwards would cost nothing and it's already technically insolvent as a deal (read: major league debt) The public ain't dumb peeps, they know a political joke when they see it: COPE/diVision. What a joke.

3) Some elections ago there were two Gordon Campbells running, and NO ONE whined and complained and the public seemed to know which one to vote for. There is ZERO proof and only innuendo planted by you clowns about James Green being attached to the NPA. BS galore. No court will over turn it and no court will look at it since the bar for the burden of proof in these cases is pretty high.

4) By my calculation, some of you assholes owe Eleanor Grgoty a MASSIVE, GARGANTUAN, apology for attacking her essentially for being a good mother. She was a great candidate and along with Capri ran great campaigns. Campaign titan awards though go to Ladner, Anton, Holden and Robertson. The absolute best the besy campaigns.

5) Sam Sullivan will return decency and integrity to the Mayor's office. He is a credit to this City. It is an absolute travesty that you clowns would try and tar someone with that much class and commitment and love for this City. If I walked into Jabba's office, he wouldn't think twice to help me cause he'd immediately know who I am. But if any of you linguine left, BMW socialists (amazing you still exist in this day and age!) showed up Sammy would put aside partisan differences. Therein lies the truth and the difference.

Give it a rest. Green should stay away from the courts. He went after JLH over nothing, he'll do the same now. IF he really cares about Woodwards, how can he unfairly tar Sam and expect top work with him. More lies from the loonie left.

I'm not letting you down yet Sleeps, I'll cut you down out of the tree only if you mea culpa properly. You spun a lot of shit about the NPA in this blog, most nonsense.

Now repeat after me...I was wrong, the NPA won, fair and square. I beleive it was you that said during the Gregory stream that all is fair in political warfare.

If you are such a storied guy, and you are, no question, the advice you should be dispensing would be to walk with grace and your dignity intact. No matter what happen, you got beat fair and square.

Interesting that there was NO coverage of Terminal City elections by our faithful scribe Mr. Holman, Hmmmm...wonder why......

Bet ya an angel or two Sleeps(your kind, you wouldn't like mine)that he Seaner would have written manya story if you boys had carried the load across the line first.

Listen, be proud, you ran a lousy campaign, divided and still got some good advertising etc.

Better than we did last time.

Sleep well.

JLH, my dear,

I don't agree with more than 10% of what you say, as the rest is fluff, but I have to apologize in that I underestimated you. Upon cursory review of even one of your websites, you clearly care about this City and had some very good ideas. Your incredible stupidity about the new stadium notwithstanding, you are to be commended. Nice work for an independent, with all the composure of a sideways rocket headed for open ocean.

If you could just tone down the smoochy hoochy koochy, I think you might find yourself in class with the rest of the students one day. Instead, the longer you keep the antics up, you'll be the eternal hallway monitor, with no clipbaord.....

Nice conservative grey suit at the NPA bash by the way. Now if we could just do something about that do.....

Lose the Queen of Farts BS, stick to your very apropos defence of the girls and boys on the strip, drugs and treatment etc, and I'm telling you, someday, it'll make the difference for you, like you have made the differnce for so many in the past.

Keep it up...oops!

Sleeps, you can accuse me of being a blinded supporter, but I'm also a statistics geek, and the first thing I did Sunday morning, was to pool over the riding by riding statistics for James Green.

For starters, he did not achieve any higher numbers in polls that are known to be heavily ESL neighbourhoods. He consistently received 2-3% of the vote in each poll. The only areas where he got a slightly higher was in the city center polls, around hastings park, and close to 29th avenue skytrain. Hastings park a backlash due to slots being imposed, and the other areas generally have a higher support for independents.

I won't deny that some of his votes may be in error, but from looking at past results, the most heavily publicized independents regularly draw in 2k voters, and VCA teams mayoral pulled in over 7k last time. Look at the last half dozen elections in Vancouver, you will nearly always get about 15% of people who will not vote for a major party.

In order for him to not have been a spoiler, he only needed to bring in 500 votes, which is far under the amount that leading independents get. Believe me, I was watching the spread on shaw all night, and got edgy it got close. However, until the last dozen or so polls came in, Sam was more than the combined Greens.

As for your conclusions:

"Common sense and the evidence tells us two things:

1. An unknown candidate with dodgy credentials is a 300 vote wonder.
2. The NPA were involved in James Green's campaign"

There is really no sign of common sense or evidence. Its called paranoia and partisanship. He was an unknown candidate until the second he stepped in the ring, and then he made all the papers. Almost everyone I talked to knew he was, even if they didn't know what he stood for. Heck, most people I talked to didn't know anything about his policy, but we knew he was before Sam took the NPA nod. Myself and a cohort were talking about supporting him if Christy took the nod, and so I wouldn't doubt if some of Christy's people were speaking the same thing. As for his credentials, yeah, I read the Tyee article as well, but the MSM never dove into his past. Regardless, did you ever hear him speak, go to all candidates meetings. He actually campaigned, and got exposure. He was articulate, and was by far the best dressed candidate in the whole election.

As for NPA support, you still have no evidence. Having Sam offer to try to get his office back means little, especially as he didn't take them up on it. But poof, I guess your dreamworld definition of evidence, and the whole dictionary/legal definition are two seperate things. You have no idea about his personal finances, and all you have is hearsay on his credentials. We know he was a Trusteee at one point, so he's one campaigns in the past. His bus rental is not $1000 a day. Its the off season right now, (between Ski Season and Summer) and you can get a block rental for a decent price. Heck, you can buy a bus for 40K US if you want. And all he did was stick hand made JAMES GREEN for MAYOR decos on the side, which he pulled off for election day.

Now to take your side for a bit: Once Again, don't you be gloating too much. You didn't have nearly the same confidence in the NPA or Sam in the days leading up to the election.

Budd, you miserable (but lovable) old sock, your reasoning on the stats is right on, but doesn't go beyond the propaganda, so lemme help you across the river of truth oldtimer...

Here's the bottom line.....

If you took all the polls were the left nutters are claiming that there was Green skullduggery, and added all the numbers that they clain went from one Green to another, Sam Sullivan would have still won by two thousand votes.

The idiot prof who was quted in the Bula column in the Sun failed miserably to point that out. Was there correlation to Jabba polls in higher non-English speaking neighbourhoods, sure there was. You can make stats favour anyone.

Bu the fact remains that even if you added all those numbers (as the rest were evenly distributed throughout the City, then Sam sullivan would still be MAtor with a very comfortable margin of just north of two thousand votes.

Na na na na, na na na na, hey, hey, hey, good-bye...

Everyone sing along together now to the Jim Green theme song, na na na na, na na na na, hey, hey, hey, goodbye.......

Oh and by the way, Sleeps, between enjoying myself thoroughly at the Hotel Van, I slipped out at around eleven for about an hour to the JA for a little cheer. Sorry to hear you were in bed, I lit one up in your honour......

God love a duck, you lost in Surrey and Vancouver, what the hell will you do?

Oh well, there's always the unions, eh?

Oh Danny Boy.....those pipes once again...

You are correct I predicted a loss then a win, then a loss, then a win again, and was torn the whole last three days.

We won despite ourselves. If we had a decent campaign prior to Mike Hillman and Colin Metcalfe (they saved us), I wonder what could have been. But the wankers in the crowsnest, decided that the candidates were on their own (no support) and the stupidity gymnastics of management were astounding. Add Witchy Poo and her broom in for good measure, and if COPE/diVision hadn't divided, I'll tell you what, we'd have to listen to Sleeps gloating for about a year! The pendulum would have swung the other way and the NPA would be in opposition again. Truth be told, the candidates saw this and ran some very good, but independent campaigns, and so they should have. We had some really good people running that won, and some stars who didn't make it. I'd love to be a fly on the ceiling in the postmortem, ooooh the shots will fly.....can't say enough about people like Anton, Ladner and the Slammin' one. Incredible. It was a situtation where the candidates and the finally duty bound youts, saved the campaign, instead of the other way around.

I'll tell you also, without betraying confidences, the "youts" on the Board of Directors carried the day, bigtime. All those folks who were not part of coup Old Shaughnessy Team Entitlement 2004, and were marginalized for months, revolted and were plonked into the right roles--all young, but experienced, as opposed to the old, no experience lackeys, whose political flagellations just kept our volunteers away. Thanks to the Three Mad Men, and their recommendations, and right people won the day. The Shaughnessy crowd, still drunk from their own bathwater, are trying desperately to have the world think they did it. Yeah, and we had a "stellar" manager and leaders as well! Cough, vomit....

The great (and very sweet) irony is that the youts will now inherit the NPA earth. They were the team that Daniel Fontaine put up in 2004 at the NPA AGM, that Greg Wilson screwed, without reason.

Now that Fontaine is Chief of Staff to the Slammin' One, he'll serve his own version of the Empire Strikes Back. He's too savvy and too smart to do otherwise.

"Tony, you should no better than this, this isn't little Havana, the world waits for no one my friend.....if you leave even any one of them standing, he'll come back at you with a vengeance one day..."

mea culpa

I should have seen it coming..that's twice now I could have offered Jim advice that he needed and I chose to remain silent. I need to trust my intuition more.

I don't think we've heard the last of the James Green fiasco yet.

I am impressed by the example that Once Again, Dan grice and even Jamie Lee have set for me. I'm not alltogether sure I would have been quite as gracious in victory as you three have been. While not perfect examples of magnanimity you three have not shown the malice that you might have..and I'm grateful. I am just a tad fragile these days...but I'm taking some small comfort in the tiny hope justice may prevail through the cosmic laws of karma. In other words...sooner or later someone will spill their guts over details regarding James Green's connections to the SS.

Guten Tag

Sleeps, you're making me sad....

Take it easy buddy. And this too shall pass sayeth the Lord...so you lost, so what? In politics my friend (and you know this), sometimes you have to lose to win. In politics, no one ever wins all the time. It's a tough business, and not for the faint of heart. "Defense de pussies", Levesque once said to Trudeau, who was in his usual snit.

Look, why are we all on this bloody planet? To try to get along with one another and help each other along, particularly those that struggle. You think I don't think about those poor pipers in Shooter's Alley when I 'm in the grotto (ok, not often, but I have!) You guys just forgot what got you there (City Hall). People love a hero, particularly one that will sacrifice. Sammy is the real thing, Larry played it to the hilt, and Jabba just played with his kilt. COPE/VV just blew up. If you had some cohesion and we had the same central campaign trash going on, beleive me, there would be no empty Pimm's bottles on the porches in Shaughnessy after this weekend.

You cannot win anymore with giggling idiots like Roberts who can't even make a proper motion, Louis who wants to refight the battles between Puil and Yorke, and Woodsworth and Bass who want to talk about spaceships and Dubya. It just won't happen. The only guy on your side who's a real clown is Stevenson (ok, we have May-in-court, I concede) who just seems to have such a disconnect sometimes, I wonder how he beat out a million other sperm.....Louie is a star and understands the City and the jury's out on Deal. She could prove to be another ideologue from the looks of things.

Listen, here's what you do, in 2008 you run Gregor Robertson for Mayor. He'll never survive in Victoria with all the nutters tearing the NDP apart. He isn't union enough. He's better suited for Vancouver anyway.

And I know just to guy to screw up, er, sorry, I mean be your campaign manager...Greg Wilson. He just adores him.

:-)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

And please believe me, if James Green was connected to the All Slammin' One, I would know about it. Trust me, it's just not true.

Thanks for the compliments. Sorry we weren't there together to remove our masks. Oh well, I'll be moving along soon anyway. Danny Boy is indeed gracious and so is the Queen, there I said it, are you happy JLH? :-)))))

God, I'm being so nice, what wrong with me......

"If you took all the polls were the left nutters are claiming that there was Green skullduggery, and added all the numbers that they clain went from one Green to another, Sam Sullivan would have still won by two thousand votes."

Posted by Once Again on November 23, 2005 11:31 PM

The analysis you're refering to was done by a political science grad student, not a professor, but was validated by a professor, the head of the department in fact. The idea is simple. There is a linear statistical correlation between the poll by poll votes for the two Greens, with James Green getting basically 5% of the votes of Jim Green right across the city. In other words, they either appealed directly to the exactly same issues, beliefs, etc., and in exactly the same proportions, ... or else one is driven off the other.

I think you need to realize that the cost here for Sullivan is not losing office but gaining office and losing reputation. He's coming into office with the same bad odour around his election as George W. Bush in 2000. Unlike Bush, he isn't going to have some external enemy, some Bin Laden, come to town and turn him into a {perceived} giant.

Once Again

Your words do give me comfort. I'm coming to believe that civic politics does produce pols who are indeed passionate about the patch they are governing. It is, after all, where they live and humans usually try not to crap where they eat.

I don't know Sam but our battles have given me an insight into the psyche of an NPA backroom operative and I can't say I'm as rabidly opposed to what your party stands for as I once was. It's obvious that it's not necessarily all about right wing ideology.

Since we will never know precisely how many people mistakenly voted for James Green it strikes me as being fair, though not economic, to have a runoff to end the controversy once and for all. This would remove any lingering doubts about Sam's victory...the taint would be gone.
It wouldn't need to cost the taxpayers a penny. Perhaps a small group of well heeled toffs could chip in to fund it...just like they did for James.

Budd, you benevolent ignoramus......

The point is that if you added up the statistical anomalies and doubled them, Sam still wins by three votes. That's how far fetched your bullshit math is.

The grad student and the head of department, and you, must smoke a lota hookah.....

Great, there is a linear correlation in some polls, but NOT in most. He is WRONG. I have a few freunds around town, and the skew is in. Ivory tower bullshiters like the good professor get it wrong almost everytime. Or you can find another one who will write something else for you.

Point being, in those polls where Green and Green were in a mistaken feeding frenzy, you take a sampling, plus or minus, and I'm saying throw in ALL those ballots in those polls--Sam still wins by just over two thousand votes.....

Budd, Budd, Budd.....tsk, tsk, tsk.

Repeat after me: we lost and I'm going to be as graceful as Sleeps and leave it alone.

Sam will have no problem with this. There are no hanging chads. The public know that the left are just sore losers. you guys pull this shit almost everytime. Like clockwork. Unless there's a link, there's no smoking gun. And there is NO link because James Green ran himself. The campaign bus is a BS red herring, an old one that would have cost you next to nothing. He put stickers on it for Heaven's sake! Wehere's the fancy campaign. He was very elegantly attired, but wore the same suit almost everyday! He spent twelve grand to run for Mayor (The Sun/Province). WOW......heavy...

You lefty crackpots are reeeeeeally stretching here...

Sleeps my friend, worry not.

There is a great deal I like about Cadman and Louie too, so in this place we call home, sure, there can be lots of overlap. When I think about great public servants, I think about guys like Alex MacDonald and Harry Rankin, so I'm not as opposed to some reasonable left coasters either. Reason is the key. IF we all learned to tone down the vitriol and work together, Vancouver'd be a much better place. Larry, in retrospect, was an ass, who was a divider. he had some good qualities (maybe two) but he was a fooll about much.

Would Jim offere a run off to Sam if the roles were reversed?

C'mon pal, it's over. Fat Lady cleared her throat on Saturday night at around nine o'clock and she's been singing Core Ingrato ever since...

"Budd, you benevolent ignoramus......

The point is that if you added up the statistical anomalies and doubled them, Sam still wins by three votes. That's how far fetched your bullshit math is.

The grad student and the head of department, and you, must smoke a lota hookah....."

...

Sam will have no problem with this. There are no hanging chads. ... Unless there's a link, there's no smoking gun. And there is NO link because James Green ran himself. ...He spent twelve grand to run for Mayor (The Sun/Province). WOW......heavy..."

Posted by Once Again on November 24, 2005 10:11 AM

Here's a few points. I think your statistical methods are a bit mysterious, but by your calculation Sullivan's margin would have been three (3) votes without the James Green Scam, ... er, ... Factor. Is that it? Because if it is, you're basically admitting that this was a material factor, turning a dead heat into a 3% win.

Sullivan's reputation will not be impacted because no one can prove a thing, is that it? Some people I know feel that the conduct and demeanor of Sullivan's campaign officials who've tried to explain this to the media is enough to arouse suspicion in itself. And you seem to be particulalry well informed about James Green, how much his campaign cost, etc. How is that? Do you know James Green, or does you info come from NPA officials who dealt closely with him. And where did someone who hasn't worked for a while get even $12K?

As for smoking a lotta hookah, tell me, what is Sullivan's position on decriminalizing or legalizing marijuana?

Buddly, you're bullshit is admirable but has about as much credibility as Marie Antoinetee in a soup kitchen......

Firstly, the information on James Green was in the newspapers for the last three days, at your age, you should be looking for those spectacles and spend some time in the comfortable chair reading The Sun and The Pravda, er, Province. Never met James Green, no interst, the guy ran a great campaign for an independent, as did JLH, sans the feather boas....

Secondly, my calculations are skewed in your favor BY FIFTY PERCENT, to show through incredible statistical exaggeration, that even if you doubled the fudge factor, Sam still wins. All the frothy spinning you are doing isn't even laudable. Stop it. You are just embarrasing yourself.

Lastly, don't you think that the media would have it in for Sammy anyway. the covergae was so godamn well skewed in Jabba Jim's direction that I couldn't wait for the next COPE opinion piece to be written by Jeff Lee or Irwin Loy. By comparison Bula was balanced. So, of course the media are wanting more out of this. The story has about as much legs as Dubya's Nat'l Guard service (and there is lots to attack him for, but that wasn't it). So call Dan Rather, great balanced jounalist his is, they canned 'im.

Give it up Budd. Too much hookah.

Enjoy.

Once again, Once Again, I am having difficulty following your statistical argument. The last time you seemed to be saying that, were it not for the James Green Siphon, Sullivan's margin would have been three (3) votes, a fancy name for zero. Now, it's ... what? Not a factor at all?

I think some people on the NPA side have convinced themselves that JLH and the James Green Gimmick will never stick to them, no matter what. They could be in for a rude shock.

And you keep suggesting too much inebriation, yet I notice to my great distress that you are using the same "Jabba the Hutt" nickname for Jim Green that the notorious and odious Liberal Steve Hopkins uses. He won't tell me the origins of this thing, so can you? It sounds like the product of a mind whose connection to sobriety has been permanently breached.

Jim Green probably has no legal grounds to stand on. Barring some kind of evidence of ballot tampering, or some other gross violation of the election code, Sam Sullivan is the new mayor.
However dirty the trick is, and there is no denying that samwise had his hands in propping up James Green, the appearance of something amiss is enough to taint the mayoralty of Sullivan and his NPA-Liberals.
The Vision/Cope opposition's best hope is that the rest of the NPA caucus have more ethics than trickster Samwise, and hopefully make this council work. Being adversarial and overtly partisan will destroy the vision/cope teams and give unwarrented credibility to the NPA-Liberals.
Time to let this issue go. Samwise is damaged and tainted, and thats a good start for the 2008 campaign for his next opponent.

I'd love to see Jim vs. Svend in an all-out, no holds-barred nomination fight. Could get NASTY!

By the way, do any of you on the Left know which miscreant is responsible for the appearance of South Park disabled cartoon character, "Timmy" on so many blogs and websites, since Sam's victory on Saturday?

Makes you wonder what kind of stuff might appear if above-mentioned nomination tilt happens....

Once Again were you spying on me at the NPA bash!!! As Harry Rankin used to say to me, JL you gotta have some conservative suits for those times when you gotta be serious. But seriously OA I thought my 'do' was conservative as well. In any event don't tell those lefties that my suits are designer Jones of New York nor heavin forbid that I wear a real fur. They will chop me up for mincemeat!!!

Poor Budd and all those other psuedo lefties can't take defeat well. Its so sad!

Sleeps with Angels, enjoy your trips wherever they take you.

And Once again, I promise just for you, I'll tone it down a tad. But my weblog stays as is!

Thanks again, everyone for keeping me alive!

Now back to my lawsuit against JG.

Budd, you are light, aren't you?

Your confsuion is unsurprising, oh well, c'est ca.

You continue to believe the bullshit and keep trying to spread it and in 2008, we'll mop the floor with you bigtime, because the Pimm's crowd will be gone, Wilson, with any luck, will be Mary Pynenburg's constituency twit, and all will be wonderful.

I am not going to go over this again. I don't think you're an idiot, and I've learned to like you too much to call you one again, but your BS is laughable.

P. Kelly is nuts! there is just no other way about it. There is tarring or feathering of the Slammin' Sammy, as the honeymoon with this guy will last forever. Too good a guy.

See you around suckas!!!!!!!

Jim Green likely won't run for the NDP in Vancouver Centre. He seems more interested in local than national issues, but also his chances of knocking off Hedy Fry are very low, whereas at least Svend Robinson will make it a tight race, although there is no guarantee he will win. Remember, this includes the high-end condos in Yaletown and Coal Harbour, which aren't likely to go NDP. Those areas would be more likely to go Conservative than NDP (although the Conservatives have absolutely no chance at taking the riding). I think Doug McCallum would have been better to run in Newton-North Delta, where he did quite well vs. South Surrey-Cloverdale-White Rock where most of the polls were won by Diane Watts. That being said, with more and more people from the city moving out to South Surrey, I don't think the Conservatives have a lock on that riding as they do further to the East i.e. Langley, Abbotsford. I personally would like to see Russ Hiebert defeated as his social views are quite extreme. Val Meredith was a far better MP. Even she couldn't stand Russ Hiebert and in fact had a Liberal lawn sign last election.

Budd, you are light, aren't you?

Your confusion is unsurprising, oh well, c'est ca.

You continue to believe the nonsense and keep trying to spread it and in 2008, we'll mop the floor with you bigtime, because the Pimm's crowd will be gone, Wilson, with any luck, will be Mary Pynenburg's constituency twit, and all will be wonderful.

I am not going to go over this again. I don't think you're daft, and I've learned to like you too much to call you that again, but your BS is laughable.

P. Kelly is bananas! There is just no other way about it. There is no tarring or feathering of the Slammin' Sammy, as the honeymoon with this guy will last forever. Too good a guy.

See you around girls!!!!!!!

I am beginning to suspect, Once Again, that you have no better statistical argument to offer than JLH. Sorry to say, but you're blustering doesn't cover up the fact that you can see what the numbers mean just as well as anyone.

Between the JLH and James Green capers, Sam Sullivan comes to office with a bad odour in the air. If he personally knew about this stuff, he's finished. If he didn't, well, he does now, and will have to clean house.

Oh Budd get real. My caper was to inform the public that a senior manager from DERA in 92 came forward just days before my fficial announcement alleging that Jim Green stole from the poorest of the poor. I'm an advocate for the DTES and you expected me to be part of that cover-up I suppose. This matter will finally be in court and then let's see Budd who is the sleazebag here.

Get a life, your American friend lost. Why can't you move on?

And a piece of advice Budd in the end the Truth always prevails.

JLH, am I to understand that you think that Jim Green's American origins are an issue of some sort? If so, please elaborate.

As you say, the truth does prevail in the end, and I am about 20 to 25 percent confident that our media will get to the bottom of your connections to the NPA and Sullivan campaigns, and your arrangements with Lorne Meinkampf. Sometime in the next 20 to 25 years, that is.

Of course I think Jim Green's citizenship is an issue. You on the other hand don't. If Jim Green sought amnesty under the Jimmy Carter provision, re:deserting his country, he would have needed to ask for official forgiveness for deserting his country. He would also have been allowed to retain his American citizenship. I think because he ran for the top political position in our City which by the way is still a Canadian City, therefore its fair to bring up the matter of his Citizenship. Its probably not an issue now that he lost but if he seeks the Leadership of the Provincial NDP, which many expect him to do, then I'll bring it up again.

First though he will need to destabilize the NDP but that shouldn't be hard since one of his diVision candidates, Heather Harrison, is running for the Vice-Presidency of the NDP.

As for your silly immature comments, re:my connections to the NPA and Sam Sullivan what are you referring to? Are people in your narrow world-view not allowed to have friends within various political tents?

God you psuedo leftists always paint a picture of some conspiracy or another. You come across as Nutz when you do this. What sort of arrangement pray tell did I have with Lorne Mayencourt?

If you think there is something untoward between us, spill it out or else as Harry Rankin used to say, keep your Yap shut.

Thank You

Ah luv the smell of rancor in tha evening..
..smells lak....vitriol

If Sean is listening I'd like to suggest he underwrite a party for fans and foes alike who shed blood on this blog. By all means..charge a cover and have a cash bar so your're not out of pocket when the thing is over and all the blood and broken bones are bussed.

Just before xmas or early in the new year would work just fine. Maybe some basement in Blood Alley or a plush, pleasure dome in the wild West End.

The bartender at the COPE "victory" party (quoted in the Courier) : "Sullivan won? Oh man, that's not good".

I love the idea Sleeps, but we have a federal election coming up. Will we be able to keep our hands off each others necks?

As for those who still think JLH is a conspiracy, come on, take a look at her blog downtowneastside.blogspot.com. Or witness her posting here. Believe me, as someone who worked on her campaign, she is no one's puppet! Just keep on her good side if you have any discrepancies in your past.

It's late Jamie Lee, and I can only say that I have no time for your rhubbish in more ways that one! Your brazen insincerity really sucks the big one!

So intellectual of you Budd. Now your attacking the Sex Worker community I suppose. After us, who's next on your radar?

Oh Budd?

Seems that everytime you get cornered and have nothing but the usual propaganda or piffle to offer, you get frothy and angry. Not good my man.

JLH, God love 'er, really got under your skin! And she's tame compared to me and Sleeps! You know I'm beginning to rethermalize to JLH. She even promised to tone it down! Now people will take you serioulsy ALL THE TIME, and Budd will be even more befuddled! I love it!!!!!

How 'bout I we all cool it for at least the weekend. I'm starting early......

Play safe, go Alouettes!!!!!!!!!!!

Good weekend to all.

Prediction

Eastern Separatists 24
Western Aryan Nation 20

*note: whenever I hear the term western alienation and I look at the reformers I can't help but hear western "aryan nation"

I believe Western Alienation is a very real concept that exists with people across the political spectrum. The only reason it is associated with the Reform/Alliance/Conservatives is they had to find an issue that resonated with the public. The reality is if they ran on their hard right agenda versus their populist agenda, they would gone nowhere in the West as most Westerners are not radical right wingers. People like Randy White, Darrel Stinson, Sharon Hayes, Bob Rigma, Myron Thompson, and Rob Anders do not represent most Western Canadians. There are nutbars like them in all parts of Canada, they just haven't been able to get elected elsewhere.

"So intellectual of you Budd. Now your attacking the Sex Worker community I suppose. After us, who's next on your radar?"

Posted by jamie lee at November 25, 2005 09:22 AM

"Oh Budd?

Seems that everytime you get cornered and have nothing but the usual propaganda or piffle to offer, you get frothy and angry. Not good my man."

Posted by Once Again at November 25, 2005 10:43 AM

I'm afraid, Once Again, that you're getting kind of lame, and I notice that, once again, we are just short of the weekend. So it's the usual situation where you need your weekend battery recharging to get back into full swing for Monday.

As for JLH, I really don't care, she's a person of absolutely no credibility, not because of her occupation, but because of her character.

I have to agree Miles. Having spent the first 30 years of my life in the east I was able to witness lots of bigotry and racism up close. I'm hoping those particular folks don't take a shine to Harper's brand as Ontario, as usual, will be a key battleground.

One has to wonder why right of center politics seems to be the domain where people with the aforementioned character flaws seem to be happiest.