What's the cost of having your picture on the front cover of an influential publication like BC Business Magazine? I sure hope he gets a tax receipt for that in-kind donation to the BC Liberal Party.

This is yet another shining example of why we so badly need electoral finance reform in this province.

Who is BC Business magazine influencing? This is really just a token jester. My guess is that 98% of their readers are voting Liberal anyway. After all who would read a Business magazine then vote for a party that does whatever it can to hurt business. Electoral finance reform just means the taxpayer will foot more of the bill for elections. Why not let the unions and business donate their own money?

Peter Legge will be running for Mayor on Tory/Socred dominated "Team Burnaby" civic Party slate which is headed by Brian Bonney (3 time failed civic candidate, former Tory, former Socred, former BVA, former NPA, former BVNPA, turned BC Liberal). After his communications business went bankrupt, Brian Bonney was hired with help the help of his Socred friends as a field organizer for the BC Liberal Party.

I'd hate to think that your personal dislike for the Premier has anything to do with your stance on electoral finance reform, Andrew!

The bottom line here is freedom of speech. We recently launched a new campus newspaper called Liberte and ran a front page feature interview with the Premier. Not only is it newsworthy, but it also a great way to give the Premier a boost on campuses, an admittedly hostile environment.

I think a picture of his mugshot would have been more apporiate, but apparently the Lib loving Vancouver Hotel Association have dibs on that.

I'm still miffed at the constant tongue lashings the NDP get for getting union support and when Businesses - who love a Premier that likes a $2.50 minimum wage - bankroll and take over the Premiers ministry of Propaganda, it's ok.

Gliberals:
Kings of the double standard.
Queens of Hypocrisy.
Jacks of Asses.

Bongo, very funny re: "token jester"!

The reason buisnesses support the premier is because he is a champion of the average person to make something of themselves in this province,something the NDP tries to quash any chance they get.Everyone in this province knows just how dangerous the NDP are and will come together to once and for all put an end to union influence in this province.Until the last vestiges of socialism are scraped off the shoe of this great province,we will never be free to prosper and succeed.This is encouraging to see that we have one more tool at our disposal,which we have earned through careful and sensitve reworking of a sick and bloated system.Lets hope we can get rid of the NDP once and for all.With the help of the media we can make this a reality,for the good of buisness in BC.
God bless Gordon Campbell

My personal dislike of this premier and this government has nothing to do with it. This magazine publisher has come out and said (paraphrasing) "I like this government so I'm going to put a picture of it's leader on the front cover of my magazine". That's not journalism, that's third party political advertising. I'm not saying he shouldn't be allowed to do it, I'm saying it should be recognized as such and the BC Liberals should recognize his donation with a tax receipt.

That all said, of course I'd rather that these types of corporate donations be forbidden. Why should any organization (be they profit or labour driven) be permitted to interfere in elections? Unless we're prepared to recognize a company or a union as a citizen with voting rights, they shouldn't be behaving like one.

peeved:
Thanks for the laugh. That was perfect.

As we've seen in the last US Presidential Election, most electoral reforms aimed to curb third party spending are usually circumvented by loopholes (see the 527 rule). Pursuing electoral finance reform may be a worthy endeavour, but its effectiveness is certainly in doubt.

If third parties want to buy advertisements, I say let them go for it. They can be effective, entertaining, and informative. They can also be none of the above, but that is the beauty of democracy - citizens can decide for themselves what they think of the ads and how it affects their vote.

Andrew-

You raise an excellent point. It's clear that by being featured in a magazine, the premier is getting free publicity, which is essentially a donation to his campaign. I would like to go further and say that, by this logic, any time a newspaper or magazine says anything about a politician it is publicity and thus should be treated as a donation to that politician.

I anxiously await the day that the Globe and Mail has to declare a donation each time it features Paul Martin on its front page. Thank you for sharing your wisdom regarding campaign finance law with us.

527's in BC, I like it. How about "Maui Constables for Truth"

I personally would prefer something like "Deck Builders For Truth", "Fast Ferry Workers For Truth", or "Survivors of the NDP-created Economic Stagnation for Truth"

As a bonus, it would also provide an upside if Gordo isn't re-elected and Carole James ends up being premier-- I would love to see the day that "Muffin Bakers for Truth" make the headlines.

"Deck Builders for Truth" of course being based in Germany...

Can we take it for granted that peeved is a phoney, a fake creation of some NDP adherent? I'm an NDP adherent as well, a self employed social critic, and it looks to me like peeved has been created to spell out the Liberals' anti-labour tendencies.

On a day when I am not feeling worried about the future, I can really enjoy the pitiful bits of amateur sociology that pass for political discourse in BC. It all boils down to one rant versus another over what kinds of highly stereotypical people one personally likes or dislikes. Political parties are visualized in terms of the type of character you see arguing their case at social gatherings and drinking parties. This is then offered up with a raft of fake economic data as though it were a rational argument. Is it any wonder that people from Toronto are still describing BC politics as wacko and flakey?

Just one question. Why does every NDP supporter say any positive economic news is fake or propaganda? They then tear apart statistical data with unsubstantiated data, then call the statistical data lies. Just wondering how you do it.

I also enjoyed your post, peeved. My favorite episode of Gordon Campbell was the one where he drove drunk at 70 miles per hour at blood alcohol .16, and then cried on TV. That was the best.

Second thought- If the NDP was so horrible, I wonder why the company I work for did a large expansion in 1997. Also, I wonder why I did so well economically in the 90`s? Just wondering.

Your attempt to mislead people is transparent, Bongo. No one objects to valid statistics presented in an honest fashion. What the do object to, and should, is the deliberate and intentional misuse of "data". For an example of recent data manipulations and deceptions by the BC Liberal Govt, not the only practitioner of this black art by any means, but the one closest to home as it were, consider this item by economist David Schreck:

(http://www.strategicthoughts.com/record2004/halftruths.html)

The BC premier and tbe booming economy are legitimate topics for BC Business to have in it.

Furthermore, the article was written by Paul Willcocks, a respected and hard working member of the press gallery.

The article is legit journalism

You politicos are funny.

It's about time that the BC Business community starts putting their money where their mouth is.

Legge has a private magazine, last time I checked he can put whoever he wants on the cover.

The BCTF, BC Fed, CUPE, BCGEU and other big public sector unions, (notice no private sector union, as aside from the BC Fed, which includes the private sector, but lets face it, the BC Fed is dominated by the public sector unions), are planning to spend money big time int he election.

It is only the BC Libs who had the testicular fortitude to have a real democratic process like fix election dates, that allow these unions to set up their war chest for the up comming election.

The NDP may get only 15% from unions in direct case but in this soft money/indirect cash they will have more like 80%, when all is said and done.

I hope the Chamber of Commerces and other business organization will step up and do their own advertising during the election to counter all the public sector union cash.

It is also really hypocritcal for the Dippers to start whinig about party financing since if they wanted to out law union and business donations they could have done so when they were in power.

I think the BC government should cap business and union donations and then force all 3rd party political advertising / donations to register with elections BC, (like they have to do in the US).

Then the public might get to see how much both the unions and business spend on their respective favourite parties.

Cheers
Newman

First, considering that the BC Liberals, by way of the old Social Credit Party and back again, have always been funded by business, this would hardly be something new.

Second, Andrew has the right idea here of looking at this as an in-kind donation. And I would like to add something that we all know, which is that the business/labour dichotomy that Newman, and the BC Liberals generally, are playing up is ridiculously asymmetrical: the BC Fed and BCTF may spend a million dollars, but that's really the only time their positions will be heard. It's a splash in the sea of pro-BC Liberal Can West editorial pages, pro-BC Liberal business and tourist board sponsored publicity, pro-BC Liberal government-funded media campaigns, and the like.

If you took a break from yourselves, and wanted to be serious for a just moment, you might ask (I'm directing this to "Newman") why most so-called conservatives even support the BC Liberal party, a party more corporatist than populist. Okay, to the libertarian, the ideology of privatization sounds great, but as an administrator, that is, when condidering the practical expression of this ideology, you find that it's something altogether different. We send ship-building to Germany, we send jobs to Germany, it's that simple - but, of course, only one Liberal MLA opposed it. If you knew your BC history, you'd know that you're where you are partly because of elite fear of socialism, partly because of the opportunism of various influencial politicians. The point is that to those with any knowledge of fact or the historical record (sadly, not many people) your position is difficult to take seriously.

So finally, Mr. Newman, because I'm feeling combatative, I'll ask you: what do you believe that makes you defend these guys so strongly? I ask because I'm wondering, and I've never understood.

.......

David M--

"If you knew your BC history, you'd know that you're where you are partly because of elite fear of socialism, partly because of the opportunism of various influential politicians. The point is that to those with any knowledge of fact or the historical record (sadly, not many people) your position is difficult to take seriously."

Full of yourself, are we? You might want to sit down one day and consider the possibility that it might not be out of pure ignorance that people believe differently than you. Then again, the assumption made on your part is why the left has been so pathetic as of late. Good work on completely underestimating your political adversaries.

As per the 'in kind contribution' thing, it would create several pragmatic problems. What is the monetary value one would declare for a front cover photo spread? (There are no comparable ad rates, since most publications don't allow for full page front cover ads) Would a magazine dealing with politics, like Macleans, have to consider their political coverage to be a contribution to the politicians they cover? If not, how do you determine which magazines are making campaign contributions and which aren't? Does it only apply to magazines? Would a newspaper writing an article about, or giving an endorsement to, a particular candidate be considered a contribution?

In short, your endorsement of making this kind of thing a campaign contribution shows your complete and utter lack of understanding of the issue. Perhaps it is your political views that are a reflection on your ignorance, contrary to your assertion otherwise?

hey bud cambell,, is david shrek the same guy that shit all over dosangh before the last election?
i,ll assume he,s not sleeping on the couch any more.
tyeeeeyaa

nic

Dear "David M"

I suppose I will respond to you query.

Why I support the BC Libs?

As you so easily pointed out I am very much a conservative/libertarian minded type, with a populist streak.

Since the current state of political affairs in BC, dictates that there are only 2 parties that have an iota of a chance of winning a seat in our first past the post system, I must choose the best of the two.

For me it is an easy choice. While I don;t agree with everything the BC Libs have done, I certainly agree with the BC Libs far more than I ever would agree with the NDP.

The NDP are pure lefty socialists, who are increasingly pushing out moderates (see- Nils Jensen, a nice little Dipper). If the best "moderate" socialist that the Dippers can come up with is Rob Flemming, Mr. I was a university Communist Party Member of thier own lil' poliburo, and is famous for imperonating University staff to have his opposition's signs torn down, then gee the NDP is looking REALLY moderate eh?

Also case in point when you say:
"We send ship-building to Germany, we send jobs to Germany, it's that simple - but, of course, only one Liberal MLA opposed it"

Don't you understand the concept of free market or free trade????

The BC Libs sent, (actually it was the BC Ferry Corp, an indep quasi crown corp, but I suppose the BC Libs could have stomped on them and forced the contract issue), the ferry contract to Germany because it was the best price!!

The only "BC bid" was from the Washington Marine Group, you know the clever chaps that helped built the good'ol Fast Cats! Their bid was significantly more than the Germans (even given the fact that the ferries would have to be shipped from germany to BC!).

In fact thier bid would not have even had many BC jobs since the content of the bid would have meant that the Ferrys would have been built in CHINA! but "assembled" in BC. Wow there's a good ship building industry eh, built in China assembled in BC!

It was not a popular decision of the BC Libs to let the ferry contract go to the Germans, but it was the right one, since my taxpayer dollars should get the most bang for my buck, and not subidize business or unions, which the NDP would do if they ever get back into power.

Any real so-called conservative would understand that and do their darnest to make sure the Dippers never ever get into power - just a friendly jab towards you Andrew! heh :)

If the STV passes, then pure lain conservatives and other voters would have a reasonable chance to elect someone other than a BC Lib or NDPer. I support STV 100%, because of that and salute the BC Libs for it.

However, that is also why the NDP and BC Lib establishment, in a rare show one single-minded unity, are 100% against STV, and are praying that STV fails and are trying to deep six it before the May Vote.

And to cut off you NDPers with respect to "subsidize" business, yes the NDP would and have. Have you heard of Skeena Celluose?, of the above mentioned Washindton marine group. Why do you think Jimmy Pattison makes sure that he is the Dippers favourite corp guy, while doing the same for the BC Libs?

The NDP simply picks and chooses businesses to subsidize, with the cover of favouring BC or saving BC jobs. It is nice to support BC business but not at an insane subsidy like expense.

Cheers
Newman

"It was not a popular decision of the BC Libs to let the ferry contract go to the Germans, but it was the right one, since my taxpayer dollars should get the most bang for my buck

I would think most bang for the tax payer dollar would come from keeping as much of those dollars circulating within the province. Ferry workers wages would be spent here, flowing into other businesses, paying taxes etc...

Alfred E. Newman says: "The NDP may get only 15% from unions in direct case but in this soft money/indirect cash they will have more like 80%, when all is said and done." This is the kind of thing I have been talking about, the outright fabrication of fake stats and false facts when the real facts don't fit the needs of the self-righteous ideologues and hyped-up zealots doing the talking. It's disgraceful and nauseating, but it's the BC tradition, unfortunately. And I don't mind repeating myself, it's this kind of neurotic conduct that Toronto editorial writers, and yes, Toronto business executives, have in mind when they dismiss BC as the land of the Wacko and the home of the Nut.

Newman's statements about the imported German ferries are only slightly more in accord with reality. The best price is not always the best deal economically if all of the money is spent out of country. If Kyle Washington's plan was to do some work in China, it remains the case that a lot would have been done in BC. The truth is that Kyle just hasn't played ball with the Liberal bagmen, and everything else that's said about the decision to go to imports is just pure, raw, unadulterated window dressing, as guys like Newman know full well.

I guess I would respond by just reiterating and clarifying a few of points:

1) Attaching value to things like a magazine cover is simple, there are schemes that have been developed elsewhere (Israel, California), and in most of the jurisdictions in which modern campaign finance govern, those forms of donation are prohibited outright anyway. Newspaper endorsements are one thing, 'man of the year' style front-page propaganda pieces are something of an entirely different order.

2) A secondary, but significant point is that the open collusion of prominent members of the business community with the BC Liberal government during this election campaign is grounded in a material, as well as an ideological interest. Mr. Legge certainly supports privatizations and so forth philosophically, but this is also pay to play, make no mistake. Will Mr. Legge be honoured with an Order of BC (for services rendered) as his counterpart at the Vancouver Sun was just two months after the BC Liberal victory in 2001? I'm not sure, but certainly under any credible campaign finance regulations, his moves would be recognized as constituting donations.

3) To move to the more philosophical issues, I'd like to take up the ferries argument. While I do understand the libertarian position, I just have to respond and reiterate that it does not make good policy. To my mind, the 'free market' is one of the great fallacies of the current age. Any of these guys (Hahn, Michael Campbell, etc) knows that the ferried deal will harm BC interests in the long term, in ways noted elsewhere. The supply-side logic of tax cuts, for instance, suggests that it is in the public economic interest to entice people to cycle money into the economy. Whether this actually happens is unclear, but the guiding ideology here is relatively sound, where the public interest is the sustained inflow of capital. In the same vein, it seems logical to direct capital investment for major capital projects (such as these ferries) into the economy, again, for reasons we all know. In fact, the entire monetary system as it currently exists in the form of national central banks is based on this logic. By approaching it in these terms (which are, in fact, conservative, in the more reasonable mold of a Diefenbaker or a de Gaulle), we begin to see the truly erroneous, short term, and small minded logic at work in the drive to 'get the best price'. We've handed the keys of this province to a bunch of guys who appear not to have a global view on real and sustainable economic development, and instead dogmatically pursue positions and policies that are just not in the public interest. And that is unfortunate, but it's happening in other jurisdictions as well, and eventually, it will stop.

4) Do I think the BC NDP would do any better? Well, yes and no. The BC NDP, to my mind, currently lacks a vision beyond the status-quoism espoused by its current leader. I really do think that this status-quoism is superior to the outright vandalism of the BC Liberals, but I would prefer it if the BC NDP would really come out with a more critical and systematic defense of certain governing priniples, in the way Jack Layton or David Orchard has. Of course they won't, for various reasons (not too sure what they want, won't receive accurate media coverage, etc.), but at least they will put people first, since, yeah, they are the people (this cycle, I'll be choosing the NDP schoolteacher or over the BC Liberal multi-millionaire developer)

There it is.

So Budd, are you saying that the BCTF or the BC Fed does not contribute to the NDP election campaign? It's funny when a right wing poster actually backs up his posts with numbers that are verifiable he his labeled as a liar. When CanWest uses stats they are called liars. But when left wing posters base their arguments on fallacies and unsubstantiated info they are hailed as correct. This all seems a bit puzzling to me.

I am very tired of the phony manipulation by people like Legge and the business community.
It amazes me that it's fine with them to support a party that misled and lied to the people of this province and get away with it, and yet the business community says that's ok and we want more....sounds like snake oil to me.
This province didn't prosper under the liberals....it happened despite their neanderthal policies....off the backs of the seniors,poor, and working class people.Peter or Prem or whoever they are....we have had enough!!